Old 11th August 2017, 07:41 PM #1
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VRT and VAT

Made a schoolboy error and produced a bike at the VRT centre with 3500 miles on the clock. Apparently anything under 3700 is liable for VAT as well as VRT. VRT is 500 plus 1500 VAT! Bike is a 2 year old enduro that I bought in the UK and imported.

Walked away when they asked for 2K. Went back a week later with the miles above the threshold and they said that the VAT must be paid either way as it is recorded in their system.

I have heard that even if I sell the bike that the new owner will still be charged the VAT. (Sounds a bit crazy really)

Does anyone know a loophole for this scenario. I am fully aware that it is totally against EU law to demand that VAT is paid twice on an item but try telling that to revenue. I'm not even sure if exporting it and re importing it is an option at this stage as the bike seems to be black listed!

Either way... I'd rather let the bike rot in a shed before I hand over 2K to register it. Any suggestions?

Thanks,
Shane.
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Old 11th August 2017, 08:05 PM #2
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Re: VRT and VAT

Sell it to someone then buy it back
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Old 11th August 2017, 08:16 PM #3
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Re: VRT and VAT

Yes as gixxer said sell it and buy it back but I reckon ya might have to sell it to someone up north for it to work
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Old 11th August 2017, 09:27 PM #4
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Re: VRT and VAT

That's a shocker. Sell it to someone in the North and be done with it. Buy another and make sure everything is fine before you bring that in. Watch they don't get you for having it too long Ireland without registering it!
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Old 11th August 2017, 10:03 PM #5
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Re: VRT and VAT

I could sell it to a friend up north and buy it back if that would work?

Getting rid of the bike isn't really an option. Fresh 300cc 2 stroke supermoto's aren't very common!
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Old 12th August 2017, 06:23 AM #6
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Re: VRT and VAT

You can claim the UK vat back once you prove that it's paid in ROI so you will only loose 3%
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Old 12th August 2017, 06:28 AM #7
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Re: VRT and VAT

https://customs.hmrc.gov.uk/channels...165#P186_16875
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Old 12th August 2017, 08:57 AM #8
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Re: VRT and VAT

Thanks for the advice. I will call HMRC on Monday.
Has anyone here had success with this route? Very nervous to have over the cash and then to be told that I don't meet the criteria to get a refund from the UK.
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Old 12th August 2017, 09:30 AM #9
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Re: VRT and VAT

Originally Posted by Airoshane
Thanks for the advice. I will call HMRC on Monday.
Has anyone here had success with this route? Very nervous to have over the cash and then to be told that I don't meet the criteria to get a refund from the UK.
Your not the first or won't be last ! this happens every day ! once you can prove you've paid vat here in ROI you'll have no issue . Problem is once you've presented the bike now it will be on the system as imported ( new) due to mileage .
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Old 12th August 2017, 11:44 AM #10
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Re: VRT and VAT

Great country we live in. Squeeze every cent.
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Old 12th August 2017, 02:33 PM #11
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Re: VRT and VAT

jesus would it have killed them to let you go for a good spin 200mls and then let you vrt her
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Old 12th August 2017, 09:53 PM #12
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Re: VRT and VAT

That's unbelievable, my mate imported a scooter about 3 months ago. When we went to his local centre , I think it was arklow (he's in bray) your man says your mileage looks tight do you want me to add 1,000kmh to it so you won't have to pay vat?

We said no because we had worked it out and it was fine, sounds like you just got a prick.
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Old 12th August 2017, 10:11 PM #13
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Re: VRT and VAT

Do you not have a northern or uk address that you can "sell" it to? then change ownership back again once the required milage has been clocked up.
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Old 13th August 2017, 10:26 AM #14
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Re: VRT and VAT

thought you only had to pay VAT if it was less than 6 months old?
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Old 14th August 2017, 08:59 AM #15
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Re: VRT and VAT

Hit a brick wall again. Was on the phone to UK revenue and they basically washed their hands and said I should have purchased the bike VAT free and I should contact the person I bought the bike from!
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Old 14th August 2017, 09:23 AM #16
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Re: VRT and VAT

DVLA are getting difficult lately with regards to irish destined vehicles. They are not issuing logbooks to irish addresses, instead issuing cert of permanent export. NCTS will unfortunately require both, in some cases.
I blame brexit.
Revenue states (since last january ) that a New Means of transport (eligible for VAT) is
6 months old or less, or travelled 6,000km or less
. A quick google found me that.
They also say:
However, if the customer collects the new means of transport in that State, VAT should be charged by the dealer. When the customer satisfies the dealer that VAT has been paid in their Member State, the dealer should refund the VAT charged to the customer.*The dealer can then*adjust the VAT liability accordingly in their VAT return for the period.
The dealer should retain all documentary proof, such as:*
a copy of the receipt showing payment of VAT in respect of the new means of transport concerned
and
proof of the registration of the means of transport in the other Member State.
.

Basically they will wash their hands of it and say you should have done your research before you purchased.
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Old 14th August 2017, 10:13 AM #17
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Re: VRT and VAT

The DVLA NEVER issued logbooks to Irish addresses. If you buy a UK registered vehicle you must ensure you get the logbook from the seller. The seller just completes the small section that's headed "gone for permanent export" and sends that to the DVLA. If you don't get the logbook the you have to apply for a Certificate of Permanent Export. This can take up to 12 weeks to process and you must have the name and address of the "Registered Keeper". If you don't --you're screwed.

Unfortunately I think the only option open to the OP is to sell back in the UK.
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Old 14th August 2017, 10:59 AM #18
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Re: VRT and VAT

So here is where I stand...

The UK wont give me the VAT back because I bought the bike second hand. The UK VAT would have been paid on the bike when it was new. The dealer offered me a NOVA number to prove that the VAT had been paid as that bike originally came from his dealership but that won't do the trick so the Irish want their VAT and the UK won't refund it. The struggle continues...
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Old 14th August 2017, 11:27 AM #19
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Re: VRT and VAT

Originally Posted by Airoshane
So here is where I stand...

The UK wont give me the VAT back because I bought the bike second hand. The UK VAT would have been paid on the bike when it was new. The dealer offered me a NOVA number to prove that the VAT had been paid as that bike originally came from his dealership but that won't do the trick so the Irish want their VAT and the UK won't refund it. The struggle continues...
sickner
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Old 14th August 2017, 11:50 AM #20
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Re: VRT and VAT

As has been said several times here, sell it back to the uk, then reimport it here in afew days when the mileage is high enough, just make sure to not get caught driving around on it in the meantime.
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Old 14th August 2017, 11:56 AM #21
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Re: VRT and VAT

That is the next step. I have a feeling they may have black listed the bike and will try hit me again for the VAT when it comes back in on northern plates.
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Old 14th August 2017, 12:30 PM #22
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Re: VRT and VAT

Might be worth talking to the Consumer Association of Ireland.

Consumers’ Association of Ireland (Regd. No. 29112)
26 Upper Pembroke Street
Dublin 2.
Tel: (01) 637 3961
Email: [email protected]
Website: www.thecai.ie
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Old 14th August 2017, 12:50 PM #23
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Re: VRT and VAT

Originally Posted by Airoshane
That is the next step. I have a feeling they may have black listed the bike and will try hit me again for the VAT when it comes back in on northern plates.
Get someone else to bring it in next time, someone with a different name like a bro in law or a good mate.
Just pick someone who wont keep the bike
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Old 14th August 2017, 01:17 PM #24
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Re: VRT and VAT

Claiming VAT back from the UK is near impossible. They do allow you to do it but it needs to be done in advance of buying the bike new generally and even at that they don't like doing it.

What should happen is that you should show that you paid the VAT in Ireland and then they should refund you that amount but only after you have sent off the section of the V5 to the DVLA to notify them that the vehicle is gone for permanent export. It can take weeks until the vehicle is marked for permanent export in the UK.

Even if you do all of this HMRC generally says they don't refund the VAT and that's that. It's a nightmare...
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Old 30th October 2019, 03:46 PM #25
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Re: VRT and VAT

Resurrecting an old thread here.. I am in the same position now only haven't had the bike inspected yet. Anyone have any experience in this since? Anyone been able to claim the money back from HMRC? I contacted them on the phone and they told me to fill out the form and it should be no problem but I bet once I look for it they will find problems...
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Old 30th October 2019, 05:44 PM #26
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Re: VRT and VAT

Originally Posted by torquey
Resurrecting an old thread here.. I am in the same position now only haven't had the bike inspected yet. Anyone have any experience in this since? Anyone been able to claim the money back from HMRC? I contacted them on the phone and they told me to fill out the form and it should be no problem but I bet once I look for it they will find problems...
stick the miles on the bike to avoid vat, if thats not feasible, you will only get the vat back from uk if you are buying a new bike as far as i know
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